Curse

ruk1a · Jan 21, 2012, 02:42 PM // 14:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chrisworld

I used to play AB a TON back in 2007-ish. It was alive back then, alive and well. Wow. Can't believe it's so dead. Can't wait for GW 2.

No one gave a shit about the rewards, it was just fun. But I'm not saying that better rewards wouldn't make it popular again. Do we need to add zaishen boxes and 5k balth reward to every format to make them "fun"?

I think people just be bored, yo. I've never really cared about the rewards.. I got my money from pve and no need for faction when you buy the skill pack from Anet store.

fireflyry · Jan 22, 2012, 05:25 AM // 05:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by ruk1a

No one gave a shit about the rewards, it was just fun. But I'm not saying that better rewards wouldn't make it popular again. Do we need to add zaishen boxes and 5k balth reward to every format to make them "fun"?

Have to agree.

I also found adding rewards big enough to entice players usually resulted in the wrong type of players turning up and telling everyone what build to use or spamming "need healer" anyway.Usually it went from casual and cruisy, what I always thought AB was intended for, to serious friggin business and /ragequit for two days.

I'd rather not play it at all than go through that bollocks again.

Lanier · Jan 22, 2012, 06:21 AM // 06:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by fireflyry

I also found adding rewards big enough to entice players usually resulted in the wrong type of players turning up and telling everyone what build to use or spamming "need healer" anyway.Usually it went from casual and cruisy, what I always thought AB was intended for, to serious friggin business and /ragequit for two days.

/agree with this. If you want evidence of additional rewards detracting from the casual nature of pvp, then look at RA. RA used to be all about having fun.

Dzan · Jan 22, 2012, 05:48 PM // 17:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lanier

/agree with this. If you want evidence of additional rewards detracting from the casual nature of pvp, then look at RA. RA used to be all about having fun.

Really? I've been playing since launch, and RA was always about griefing and wasting time. When they introduced title rewards people actually stopped griefing in every match.

ItsJustMe · Jan 22, 2012, 08:21 PM // 20:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by fireflyry

Have to agree.

I also found adding rewards big enough to entice players usually resulted in the wrong type of players turning up and telling everyone what build to use or spamming "need healer" anyway.Usually it went from casual and cruisy, what I always thought AB was intended for, to serious friggin business and /ragequit for two days.

I'd rather not play it at all than go through that bollocks again.

I used to play AB quite a bit, and while there were some that played like this, I found the majority didn't. Just go look and see some of the crazy bs some folks are running.
I know PvE is built to allow folks to play by themselves, but PvP doesn't and you shouldn't intend to play it unless you are willing to work with others.

-i

fireflyry · Jan 23, 2012, 02:15 AM // 02:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by ItsJustMe

I know PvE is built to allow folks to play by themselves, but PvP doesn't and you shouldn't intend to play it unless you are willing to work with others.

-i

Agreed but it's AB, not GvG.

Working with others is a no-brainer but every time there was a double faction weekend the sudden appearance of rank and ping build requests was a joke.Rolling any build that wasn't a current "face roll" cookie cutter usually ended in tanties, abuse or getting kicked, regardless of build effectiveness.

Sure not always...but certainly way more often than usual.

Problem is when you add a good enough reward the "speed clear" mentality and faction chasers come into play where people want the fastest wins and most efficient builds to attain given reward as quickly as possible, especially with such a large portion of the community focused on GWAMM atm.

That's all good but it's not why I play AB at all and such mentalities often discourage players from taking part in a PvP format that was really designed for casual fun.

As such while increased reward may bring players over to AB I still think it won't actually make it any more enticing for casual players.

Each to their own.

Sankt Hallvard · Jan 23, 2012, 06:13 AM // 06:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dzan

Really? I've been playing since launch, and RA was always about griefing and wasting time. When they introduced title rewards people actually stopped griefing in every match.

I also recall a day when if you encountered a griefer you could just map out. If you do that now Anet comes and fecks you in the ess.

cormac ap dunn · Jan 23, 2012, 01:31 PM // 13:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sankt Hallvard

I also recall a day when if you encountered a griefer you could just map out. If you do that now Anet comes and fecks you in the ess.

And rightfully so. How many people just map out because they don't like the team composition? Far too many. Personally, I would love to see Anet remove the /resign function in PvP(god think of all the trouble that would have saved.) and have far more severe punishment for leavers and leeches. Too often a leaver is hoping for some freaky Ideal situation( guess they don't get that AB randomly pairs teams together, RA is, well Random Arenas, not Ideal Team Arenas, and that FA & JQ are just as random...). Why people would think that screwing over your own team shouldn't be punished is beyond me.

urania · Jan 23, 2012, 03:15 PM // 15:15

forgive us for not wanting to play in double/tripple monk teams, for not wanting to play in setups that won't EVER score a kill, for not wanting to play with people who enjoy griefing or entering with pve tank builds, for not wanting to play with flare necros, heal other rangers, meteor shower warriors, meteor sins. for not wanting to play in setups one knows won't even nail a single zbox (i.e. teams/setups that suck so hard they wont get more than 5 wins, and even then end up blaming the mo for the loss).
can you ever forgive those who wish to take part in something that is at least remotely resembling a match that might end in a kill before the 8 min mark?
oh mighty one, can you ever forgive us sinners for wishing something as... normal as that.

can you ever comprehend the fact that TA has been wiped so those who still feel the need to play a proper 4v4 match can either rage quit or sync because the vast majority of players cannot display even the most basic level of game understanding in order to contribute to their team.

why on earth do people think that not contributing to your team is ok, but refusing to play with such players is - not. you have trolled the update thread enough, it's time you stick your head out of your ass and learn to look at things from different perspectives. sure, leaving nab teams 24/7 is not ok, but neither is being forced to stay in them all the time.

Missing HB · Jan 23, 2012, 03:25 PM // 15:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by urania

forgive us for not wanting to play in double/tripple monk teams, for not wanting to play in setups that won't EVER score a kill, for not wanting to play with people who enjoy griefing or entering with pve tank builds, for not wanting to play with flare necros, heal other rangers, meteor shower warriors, meteor sins. for not wanting to play in setups one knows won't even nail a single zbox (i.e. teams/setups that suck so hard they wont get more than 5 wins, and even then end up blaming the mo for the loss).

Considering they removed TA, this point is getting valid, but it just shows how ridiculous the format( or simply PvP) is.. It's considered to be random arena so we should play with anything, but let's face it : people rarely try when it's not a team that has an healer or that has at least 2 casters...

- Quite the same for JQ : are people even trying when there are 3 bots and 5 warriors against 4 roj and 4 mesmers ? clearly not
- Same for FA : the match is pointless if luxons have no monks against turtle killers( + if they don't get stucked..)

Once again, that's an issue of organized formats being unplayable, thus people want to play and win in random formats...

Martin Alvito · Jan 23, 2012, 03:59 PM // 15:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by cormac ap dunn

And rightfully so. How many people just map out because they don't like the team composition? Far too many. Personally, I would love to see Anet remove the /resign function in PvP(god think of all the trouble that would have saved.) and have far more severe punishment for leavers and leeches.

Forcing people to play doesn't solve the underlying design problems. It's a lazy solution that's not fun and doesn't work. RA desperately needs TA and some mechanism to force serious teams over to it (such as a cap on the title around r4-6 in RA), but the current activity situation means that such a change risks turning one active format into two inactive wastelands. ANet needed to get this one right in 2009; I'm not sure that much can be done now.

The problem with AB is that it combines the worst features of all the PvP formats. You have to form a group of four, but you're randomly paired with two other teams which are likely to be frustratingly bad. It's a cap points game, which I think most players would agree is the least entertaining game mode. You spend a lot of time running instead of fighting, and the game lacks the deeper strategy derived from both sides having a single, fixed point of weakness such as the Guild Lord. The game is almost invariably decided by wiping opposing teams, but the match usually takes ten or fifteen minutes to resolve even when one side has a clear advantage.

The result is that you have to bribe most players with rewards in order to get them to enter.

cormac ap dunn · Jan 23, 2012, 04:53 PM // 16:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by urania

forgive us for not wanting to play in double/tripple monk teams, for not wanting to play in setups that won't EVER score a kill, for not wanting to play with people who enjoy griefing or entering with pve tank builds, for not wanting to play with flare necros, heal other rangers, meteor shower warriors, meteor sins. for not wanting to play in setups one knows won't even nail a single zbox (i.e. teams/setups that suck so hard they wont get more than 5 wins, and even then end up blaming the mo for the loss).
can you ever forgive those who wish to take part in something that is at least remotely resembling a match that might end in a kill before the 8 min mark?
oh mighty one, can you ever forgive us sinners for wishing something as... normal as that.

can you ever comprehend the fact that TA has been wiped so those who still feel the need to play a proper 4v4 match can either rage quit or sync because the vast majority of players cannot display even the most basic level of game understanding in order to contribute to their team.

why on earth do people think that not contributing to your team is ok, but refusing to play with such players is - not. you have trolled the update thread enough, it's time you stick your head out of your ass and learn to look at things from different perspectives. sure, leaving nab teams 24/7 is not ok, but neither is being forced to stay in them all the time.

People like you don't leave for as many of those reasons (read that as excuses) as you say. Lets look at the bolded part shall we? You want faster boxes and faster points. As far as heads being up asses yours seems firmly lodged in there. RA = Random Arenas. I find the PvX mentality of gameplay/brainwashing to be both boring and lacking any semblence of creativity, if you want a composed team there is HA/GvG. If you just leave in one of those formats flaming is the least of your worries. If the Random part is still confusing you, well I would unsqueeze those cheeks and let that overworked gray matter get some fresh air. Leaving gives dishonorable, but the mark you leave is that of an impatient child who throws a tantrum when you don't get exactly your own way.

@ martin, Though forcing people to play with others randomly may not seem efficient, is it fair to run others aground because you don't like a setup? The reason TA went the way of the dodo was the same as why HA is heading there.
AB ran adrift for an entirely different reason. Prior to the rewards update for imperial faction, AB was still relatively active. Once it became apparent JQ and FA were faster for faction gain, people seeking titles/Zkeys naturally gravitated to those formats. AB still has its charm, but until the rewards rival that of the other 2 imperial outlets, people will avoid it. This weekend reminded me about the good bits of AB. Though few and far between, its still an easy, fast format. Compared real pvp its easy to form a group, enter and play, hell it even rewards you for trying. No "oops we died after 5 minutes of gameplay, and put some effort in, naturally we get nothing " of some other forms of pvp.

Martin Alvito · Jan 23, 2012, 05:01 PM // 17:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by cormac ap dunn

@ martin, Though forcing people to play with others randomly may not seem efficient, is it fair to run others aground because you don't like a setup?

No, but the job of a game developer in a social genre is to deal with people as they are, not as they should be.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cormac ap dunn

AB ran adrift for an entirely different reason. Prior to the rewards update for imperial faction, AB was still relatively active. Once it became apparent JQ and FA were faster for faction gain, people seeking titles/Zkeys naturally gravitated to those formats. AB still has its charm, but until the rewards rival that of the other 2 imperial outlets, people will avoid it.

Which is exactly what I said in the concluding paragraph.

urania · Jan 23, 2012, 06:08 PM // 18:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by cormac ap dunn

People like you don't leave for as many of those reasons (read that as excuses) as you say. Lets look at the bolded part shall we? You want faster boxes and faster points. As far as heads being up asses yours seems firmly lodged in there. RA = Random Arenas. I find the PvX mentality of gameplay/brainwashing to be both boring and lacking any semblence of creativity, if you want a composed team there is HA/GvG. If you just leave in one of those formats flaming is the least of your worries. If the Random part is still confusing you, well I would unsqueeze those cheeks and let that overworked gray matter get some fresh air. Leaving gives dishonorable, but the mark you leave is that of an impatient child who throws a tantrum when you don't get exactly your own way.

you do realise i added the brackets part after the 'single box' with the sole intention of hinting that boxes are irrelevant. my bad, ill specifically express that which normally needs no additional explanation (unless you're playing pvp solely for pve rewards/factions - which is clearly not the type i was hinting at in my post, but you apparently could not comprehend that, being stuck up in your pvp hate as you are).

moreover, pvx is something that feeds off pvpers and their build 'creativity', not vice versa. so please, mr troll-a-lot, spare us your whine.
you dont need the most typical and effective build to get somewhere (but it most definitely helps if you roll a cookie-cutter build if you're mediocre/terrible instead of old school shock axe or zb prot). good job on yet again ignoring one of the main points in my post. and no, i will not quote it. find it.
and for the love of GW, spare us with this never ending mantra of 'creativity' pve players seem to oh so enjoy upholding. you remind me of this random sin that landed in my team and who first went 'ive been testing this build, i think it works now' and then i see it cast visions of regret.
for creativity (read: something that will actually contribute to your team) you first need proper and insightful game understanding, not just a simple desire to be different for the sake of being different.
there is no such quality as unique on GW - everything is reproducible; besides,even the quality of unique in itself is often useless. do i really need to add the "unique lol pic" again? jesus.

HA is terrible, gvg is a shadow of what it used to be. TA wasnt what it used to be either, but that in no way warranted its removal. complain to anet if you have a problem with exped players having a problem with players wanting to be 'creative' and 'unique'. go play vs AI in zaishen elite for that. i'm sure they'll give you a warm welcome.

given anet has catered to the likes of you who raised a big tantrum on how ppl did not want to play with them, my point is very valid, especially given they removed TA.

and last but most definitely not least, RA is still 4v4, you will fight in a team of >four< people, meaning 3 of them will have to carry your weight. with your 'unique' and 'non-pvx' builds, you're in effect making it a 3v4, not a 4v4. so go ahead and troll those 3 other people, but dont be surprised if you'll be trolled in return.
let me repeat myself for emphasis and because you tend to ignore the main points ive made so far: RA may be RANDOM, but you're still playing in a TEAM, and hence you must C O N T R I B U T E to that team. if you choose to be different/unique/creative for the sake of those qualities alone, then you're better off fighting in pve or vs zaishen elite. I am certain they will pose quite a challenge. and you even get factions. 2 birds with one stone!

because you seem to be enjoying to play the role of a stereotypical pvp-hater, i'll add a slightly adjusted stereotypical saying: it's not (only) what build you got, its how you use it, babe.

cant believe it is i who's feeding the troll now, how sad is that.

Gruff · Jan 23, 2012, 06:21 PM // 18:21

Well to get back on track I and my alliance friends had a lot of fun playing AB over the weekend, shame the arena can't be that active every weekend and it takes some double faction to lure the masses away from whatever else they get up to.

I play the game for enjoyment and reward of being with like minded people having a laugh, take away all the z keys,title tracks etc etc suits me!

Missing HB · Jan 23, 2012, 06:59 PM // 18:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by urania

...

I do agree with your points, but it 's still going over the main reason of why RA is here, which is having fast fun, testing builds , etc...
Obviously, when i go RA i want to have fun and have fast matches, what i'm not getting in other formats.. So sure, i'm mad and frustrated when i keep having no monk and opponent always get one, but well... if you consider rez rupters, luck match ups, blind spammers, 123 earth eles, etc... it's not making much a diference...

He wants to have fun in RA, he's right.. the problem is like i said above that we need more fun and active organized formats aside. The deletion of team arenas clearly did no good to RA, as most TA players went in RA to win, followed by GvG/HA players months later...
You need to consider there are people casually playing and they're only going in RA, whereas there are also players who aren't able to play organized formats and are thus going RA... you can't blame those casuals for doing that, it's supposed to be the point of RA....

Amy Awien · Jan 23, 2012, 07:18 PM // 19:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by urania

...

Kicking out new players with unwelcome professions and/or builds, not briefing them on goals and tactics and generally abusive behaviour towards them carries a large risk of kicking them out of the format altogether. And now the format is dead ... stop whining, it's your own doing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martin Alvito

No, but the job of a game developer in a social genre is to deal with people as they are, not as they should be.

I agree. Never imagined that could happen but for once, I agree with you.

urania · Jan 23, 2012, 07:33 PM // 19:33

^oh noes, another troll.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Missing HB

I do agree with your points, but it 's still going over the main reason of why RA is here, which is having fast fun, testing builds , etc...
Obviously, when i go RA i want to have fun and have fast matches, what i'm not getting in other formats.. So sure, i'm mad and frustrated when i keep having no monk and opponent always get one, but well... if you consider rez rupters, luck match ups, blind spammers, 123 earth eles, etc... it's not making much a diference...

He wants to have fun in RA, he's right.. the problem is like i said above that we need more fun and active organized formats aside. The deletion of team arenas clearly did no good to RA, as most TA players went in RA to win, followed by GvG/HA players months later...
You need to consider there are people casually playing and they're only going in RA, whereas there are also players who aren't able to play organized formats and are thus going RA... you can't blame those casuals for doing that, it's supposed to be the point of RA....

it wasnt that bad back during district split - when international distr actually had above-average amount of decent to good players.
besides, how can one possibly have 'fun' in an arena as degenerated as RA.
unless you're sadomasochistic, that is.

Amy Awien · Jan 23, 2012, 07:43 PM // 19:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by urania

^oh noes, another troll.

Well, that makes short work of your own arguments. Ploink.

See, that's how you wind up playing all alone, or with a handful of histrionics worshipping your narcissistic self.

Essence Snow · Jan 23, 2012, 08:52 PM // 20:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by urania

^oh noes, another troll.

it wasnt that bad back during district split - when international distr actually had above-average amount of decent to good players.
besides, how can one possibly have 'fun' in an arena as degenerated as RA.
unless you're sadomasochistic, that is.

Isn't that right on the verge of syncing? Gathering all the players you like to play with in one dist so you have a better chance to group with them.